We will get through this because...

We will get through this because we are Americans. Though not quite like this, we have faced tough times and situations before and we have always come through because we are Americans and we can face and overcome anything when we set our minds and strengths to do so.

I'm not trying to be a blowhard here or make already tough times tougher. But it seems to me that the sentiments expressed in the opening paragraph above may be the very spirit and attitude that needs to be broken in our nation. Past success in national and world affairs and facing crises of the past and overcoming them can eventually and subtly lead to a pride that fosters a attitude that WE can do whatever we set our mind to. Those are nice sentiments but the strength of man takes central stage in such thinking. The best thing we can do right now as a nation is humble ourselves before God. All national pride, "hey, we are Americans," needs to be broken. Because God has helped us in the past is no guarantee He is obligated to help us this time. We can't take our next breath or tie our shoe unless the Lord helps us and allows it. I know you know this but this crisis is a glaring reminder and questioner as where do we find our strength and reliance as a nation.

Blessings to you and yours. May the Lord keep you and bless you and surround you with ministering angels and may the indwelling Holy Spirit be your strength.

Praying the way Daniel prayed in Dan:9, that's the way we should be praying.

This present crisis can set a new direction for global affairs, prophecies are not there for nothing, their fulfillment don't need our concurrence nor understanding.

Pardon me for bringing this up, somewhere this got posted i.e. "is the current crisis lead to demise of cash and to widespread use of cryptocurrency"or what about a grave economic recession.

Perhaps, these are just wild imaginations, but somehow if they are possible, looming situation lies ahead for many people and economies, at least for a time.

I guess the choice between saving the economy or life is now giving a big headache to our leaders. Herd immunity which the UK chief scientist is aiming to, is the status that can substantially mitigate this crisis.

Massive antibody testing of populations will indicate those who had already infected but successfully developed immunity. It will determine the persons who can safely return to work now or be deployed to the front line.

Well, it is sad, if the people will fail to realize things beyond natural events

The might of America, but do you not wonder why God has allowed America to be in this state and why its very fortune is now becoming a cause of its troubles.

President Trump refuses proposals for enhanced lockdown that may severely cripple the U.S. economy. This can be a huge gamble, I guess it needs people to be in their closet and pray really hard or perhaps fast as the Jews did in the book of Esther.

The punishments and judgments meted out by God are in direct proportion to the gravity of the sins committed. Whatever the extent of the sins are determines the extent of the punishments. It seems only Christians can adequately stand in the gap right now for the church and the nation.

"Amen brother, this is a judgement of the Lord allowed on the earth. "

I'll ask the same question I asked on another thread.

COVID 19 is particularly dangerous to the elderly and those with health conditions. If this is all God's judgement, then does he have something particular against these people?

I think of my very elderly, frail grandmother. Is God out to punish her?

Or even my wife who works in healthcare on the front line and is probably more at risk, is God out to get her? Indeed, should she be helping people who are suffering if it's God's judgement and instead let them suffer their just punishment?

Same goes for other natural disasters. It's very fashionable on Sermonindex (where the topics of wrath, hell, suffering and judgement seem to be the favourite) to say they are always punishments, but it is always the poor, sick and vulnerable that come off the worst in these scenarios. The rich and otherwise healthy tend to do better. That hardly seems like perfect divine justice, but random acts of divine violence.

I mean no sneering in my comment here, these are genuine questions.

Mark said: Same goes for other natural disasters. It's very fashionable on Sermonindex (where the topics of wrath, hell, suffering and judgement seem to be the favourite) to say they are always punishments.

Mark, I won't address that statement, but I will say, 99% of the time I just read now.

It is a phenomenon that hasn’t escaped my attention (the tendency to credit God with disasters) yet it seems as it’s the result of a particular doctrine....

Your points are well taken in that more often than not (your observations are correct statistically) it’s the weakest and most vulnerable among us that suffer the most...

TBH it would not surprise me in the least if it turns out this was a man-made "manufactured” crisis- in which case I wonder would it still be the judgment of God 🤔

We are wise in our own eyes.
We know what causes earthquakes so they are not of God.
We know what causes tornadoes so they are not of God.
We know what causes disease so this is not of God.
We know about Gods love so His anger will not be kindled.
We know about Gods grace so His judgment has to pass us by.
We know the outward appearance of frailty so the hardened heart inside does not need to be touched.
And even if a person were to conceed all these things we "know" how dare anyone even imply that God could use these natural things to bring man back to Himself. How cruel!
No. We know better. We can't see ourselves doing it so we can't imagine the Lord doing it. In doing this we become idolators, creating a god in our own image, hardening our heart, and positioning ourselves as the judge of right and wrong.
I plead with the Church in America and the world. Please wake up. We should not judge the Lord we should judge ourselves that we be not judged. We must stop accusing God to excuse ourselves. Jesus message, Repent! Must be heeded today and now. Before it is too late because one day it will be.

Washad1,

Is this an indirect reply to my post? If so I would rather you do so directly and actually address my points, rather than write general assertions.

You wrote

"We know the outward appearance of frailty so the hardened heart inside does not need to be touched."

If this is reference to what I put about my frail old grandmother, then you have the wrong end of the stick. My Grandmother is a very godly woman who prays for me every day. She is anything but hard hearted.

I am not accusing God and excusing myself - I confess my sins often, and do my best to continually repent. I'm not even denying God's sovereignty over all of this.

My main point is that if we are to say this epidemic is completely the judgement of God (and I do not believe it is), then it does not seem fair or just as the sickness (and the negative economic impact) will have the worst effect on the old, already ill, vulnerable, poor and needy. These are the very people that scripture exhorts us to love and uphold (and some of the prophets even warned of God's punishment for neglecting these people).

Hi Mark: Washad 1 make a good point, namely, if we can connect a materialist answer to any occurrence God is removed by reason of 'the natural events preceding', this demands no supernatural explanation. It's really a humanist model to frame every situation so that humans need only resort to human means and intellect to overcome the situation.

But readers of scripture do not find this model for interpreting such events. What we do find is God in the middle of it all and his own explanations for it's occurrence or non-occurrence.

Every Egyptian, Assyrian, Babylonian, Philistine can consult their mediums, counselors and wise-men and obtain the answer most suiting their itching ears. But the Christian does not look at events outside of the Sovereign hand of God, it is not right to blame God for every evil that comes upon the world...nor is it right to dismiss God when evil befalls individuals or a nation.

The answer has always been insight into scripture and much prayer. The answer of 'why'? God permits this or that can be leveled at God for every single event, as we all know, Covid 19 is only one disease and just how many more can be added so as to either blame God, justify God or remove God as we see fit.

But let's not do as we see fit, let us realize whether we know God be the cause directly or indirectly, the Christian has been sent into the world to preach the gospel and minister to all. This means even if God were judging men or women...does not exclude them whatsoever from our prayers, faith and love toward God for their healing and deliverance.

I saw another pride in me during this time. Being a guy in his mid 30s, I was confident that I will survive the virus even if infected. But God later showed me, that I need to put my trust in God not in my age or fitness.

2 Cor 1:10 - He has delivered us from such a deadly peril, and He will deliver us. In Him we have placed our hope that He will yet again deliver us,

Had asked this earlier in another thread and got..... crickets-

Perhaps it will garner a response in this one, has anyone here on SI received any direct confirmation and/or mention about this virus from the Lord Himself while in prayer?

Mark. No this was not a post to disparage you grandma. This virus and most unpleasant things hurt vulnerable, frail, sickly, immunocompromised, etc. Frail seemed appropriate as it includes all of the above.
The last paragraph was who this was addressed to: you, me, us, we. The Church. Many pastors are bending over backwards to absolve God of any part in this event and others like it. Its just sad that people are in danger of death, physical and spiritual and many visible "celebrity" pastors are offering them a shot of spiritual morphine to deaden the personal and national conscience the Lord could be trying to awaken.

My apologies if this post or the other hurt anyone. I have many loved ones, elderly and otherwise health compromised who are in danger. My view has always been the church at large so I speak in a general sense.

Fletcher,
My experience with the Lord specifically concerning this is as follows. As it was becoming apparent that the virus was going to become more widespread in the U.S. many were mimimizing the impact it would have. It was only in washington at the time and confined to a nursing home there. On that day I walked by a tv in the break room at work and saw that the largest earthquake in its history had hit salt lake city. I distinctly felt the Lord say "are you still going home to watch tv?"
My impression is that this is a merciful wake up call to the Church to fast, pray, repent, and evangelize. Now it is time, it is high time that we awake out of sleep. For now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

//For now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.//

This is true for every second that has passed for the past 2000 years.

TMK. And will continue to be so until the Lord appears.
It won't be long according to Jesus. To quote the King "surely I come quickly." Amen.

//To quote the King "surely I come quickly." Amen.//

Define "quickly.”