TiltedHalo says, "But I have to say that it is because of sin that we are promised the reward of hell. Yes the wages of sin is death, I say, “ you are wrong because the verse clearly says that we are promised the reward of death and not hell.You say, “But you are taking upon a literal definition of "death".I say, “of course, Adam and Eve started to begin to die when they ate that fruit, before they ate they were not dieing at all. But It was also a spiritual death also.You say, “Not accepting this gift, & continuing to live in sin is what demands a debt paid by being completely severed from the communion with God in everlasting purgatory.I say, “You basically just agreed to my first post in this thread here but I don't believe in purgatory.Sermonindex Administrator says, after quoting Jude 6-7, “Surely with this above example it is ample to prove that the cities around along with Sodom and Gomorrah where judged and are suffering the "vengeance of eternal fire". Meaning because of their sins, specifically of "fornication" and "strange flesh" (sodomy), they were judged.”I say, “Since you are using an Old Testament referral we must see how the Old Testament Saints were saved. Gal 3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” The cities around along with Sodom and Gomorrah where not judged because of there sins but because of there unbelief. You say after quoting me," Hebrews 9:27 and as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment."I say, “ That word does not mean condemn but in Greek krisis {kree'-sis} to 1) a separating, like at a trial, or contest; 2) selection with an opinion or decision given concerning anything esp. concerning justice and injustice, right or wrong .“ So it is the judging the righteous and the wicked each have there own judgment. The righteous are judged at the Beema seat and the wicked at the White Throne of Judgment.You quoted Revelation 20:14-15, "And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."I say, “they were cast out because there name was not found written in the book of life and not because of sin. Your name gets written in it when you accept That sacrifice, along with His resurrection and repent from your sins.You Said, “Jesus became sin for us so that we would not die in our sins. And yes people are going to hell without Jesus because their sin is left on them, we must reckon our self’s dead with Christ. Read Romans 5 and 6 for a clear understanding of Christ's death and our salvation.I say, “To die IN our sins we will go to hell not Because of them.KingJimmysays after quoting John 3:18-20,” There is a partial truth to what you are saying: men go to hell because they reject Jesus. However, this key passage of Scripture teaches that the reason men reject Jesus is because they are sinners, who love their sin. Because of such, they reject Christ. Because of such, they go to hell.I say, “the Scripture does not teach that the reason men reject Jesus is because they are sinners It is because the hate the Light and hate the Truth! If what you say is true, then no one would be saved because all are sinners. The wicked are not judged because of sin but because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. John 3:18You said, “The wages of sin is death. In the day Adam and Eve ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil, they died. Literally taking what God said, they should have dropped dead that very moment. However, in that day, when they became partakers of sin, they did die: spiritually. That spiritual death manifested itself in physical death. And if you and I die physically in a state of spiritual death, you and I will enter into eternity in that same spiritual state, death, and live in hell forever and ever.I say, “I completely understand all this, please read my thread “Origin of sin & death” in the Scriptures and Doctrine section.You said, “This is what the Scriptures consistently teach. I believe what you have done with your statements is to soften the wrath of God that will be revealed from heaven against all sin, because perhaps to you it sounds too harsh, too unloving, too impersonal, and the like. If you are not careful, you could end up in the land of easy-belivism, which is where this doctrine you teach I believe is born.I say, “I did not soften the wrath of God that will be revealed from heaven against all sin. Because I still acknowledge that people go to hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: Where their worm (conscience) dieth not, and the fire is not quenched. I do not think that it is to harsh too unloving, too impersonal, and the like because I accept the reality of it no matter how God puts it, People do go to hell. It is not easy-belivism Because I tell the unsaved They will go to hell if they don’t accepted That sacrifice, along with His resurrection and repent from there sins, I am not once saved always saved which easy-belivism is found. Prove to me how this Doctrine leads in that way.
