America, the superpower

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Xu2-JIFgaDw

Do you really think America is mentioned in the Bible?

The word America is not mentioned in the bible. What they are saying is America will be a part of 'All the nations' that will battle against Jerusalem', in the fulfillment of Zechariah 14.

They also believe that an important reason why America rose to superpower is for the fulfillment of God's intent to restore the land of Israel to the Jews having Jerusalem as its capital.

I watched parts, but not all of the video. Who are "they?” Do "they” represent some group or church?

ADD: I would strongly recommend reading Matthew Henry’s commentary of Zech. 14.

They also believe that an important reason why America rose to superpower is for the fulfillment of God's intent to restore the land of Israel to the Jews having Jerusalem as its capital.

OR, it could be that God raised up and prospered the nations that He used to preach the gospel worldwide.

For example, in the days when it was said that the sun never set on the British Empire, the United Kingdom sent out missionaries far and wide, to countries both within and outside its empire, from Africa (David Livingstone, various missionary societies, etc.) to India (William Carey, various missionary societies, etc.) to China (Hudson Taylor and the China Inland Mission, various missionary societies, etc.) and elsewhere.

The United States was greatly involved in worldwide evangelisation in the last century.

For example, Billy Graham hosted "crusades”, evangelistic campaigns that ran from 1947 until his retirement in 2005. He preached to live audiences of 210 million people in more than 185 countries and territories. As of 2008, his estimated lifetime audience, including radio and television broadcasts, topped 2.2 billion.
(Source: Wikipedia).

Amir Tsarfati and Jan Markell are messianic jews, Barry Stagner is a senior pastor and speaker (christian views) in national radio and internet broadcast. I stumbled upon Amir while viewing John MacArthur in youtube. A refresher and challenging, that's what I can say about them.

@Bv

I guess they didn't miss that, 'among the important reasons' why the Lord raised America as a very powerful and rich nation. But then, consider seriously what John MacArthur believe, it maybe too late for America now. All must be ready for the new order of state of affairs.

Gal. 4:26 ”“
But THE JERUSALEM ABOVE is free; she is our mother.

Heb. 12:22-24 ”“
But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, THE HEAVENLY JERUSALEM, and to myriads of angels, to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven, and to God, the Judge of all, and to the spirits of the righteous made perfect, and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood, which speaks better than the blood of Abel.

Col. 3:1-2 ”“
Therefore if you have been raised up with Christ, keep seeking the things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God.
Set your minds on the things that are above, not on the things that are on earth.

Phil. 3:20-21 ”“
For our citizenship is in heaven, from which also we eagerly wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ; who will transform the body of our humble state into conformity with the body of His glory, by the exertion of the power that He has even to subject all things to Himself.

/ADD: I would strongly recommend reading Matthew Henry’s commentary of Zech. 14./

I did some of that reading in his commentary and was somewhat surprised and intrigued by what I read.

14:4-5
4 And in that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which faces Jerusalem on the east. And the Mount of Olives shall be split in two, from east to west, making a very large valley; half of the mountain shall move toward the north and half of it toward the south.

14:5
Then you shall flee through My mountain valley, for the mountain valley shall reach to Azal. Yes, you shall flee as you fled from the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Thus the Lord my God will come, and all the saints with You.

Matthew Henry comments:

These verses are dark and hard to be understood; but divers good expositors take this to be the meaning of them. [1.] God will carefully inspect Jerusalem, even then when the enemies of it are laying it waste: His feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, whence he may take a full view of the city and temple, (Mk. 13:3). When the refiner puts his gold into the furnace he stands by it, and has his eye upon it, to see that it receive no damage; so when Jerusalem, God’s gold, is to be refined, he will have the oversight of it. He will stand by upon the mount of Olives; this was literally fulfilled when our Lord Jesus was often upon this mountain, especially when thence he ascended up into heaven, (Acts. 1:12). It was the last place on which his feet stood on this earth, the place from which he took rise. [2.] The partition-wall between Jews and Gentiles shall be taken away. The mountains about Jerusalem, and particularly this, signified it to be an enclosure, and that it stood in the way of those who would approach to it. Between the Gentiles and Jerusalem this mountain of Bether, of division, stood, (Cant. 2:17). But by the destruction of Jerusalem this mountain shall be made to cleave in the midst, and so the Jewish pale shall be taken down, and the church laid in common with the Gentiles, who were made one with the Jews by the breaking down of this middle wall of partition, (Eph. 2:14). Who art thou, O great mountain? And a great mountain the ceremonial law was in the way of the Jews’ conversion, which, one would think, could never have been got over; yet before Christ and his gospel it was made plain. This mountain departs, this hill removes, but the covenant of peace cannot be broken; for peace is still preached to him that is afar off and to those that are nigh. [3.] A new and living way shall be opened to the new Jerusalem, both to see it and to come into it. The mountain being divided, one-half towards the north and the other half towards the south, there shall be a very great valley, that is, a broad way of communication opened between Jerusalem and the Gentile world, by which the Gentiles shall have free admission into the gospel-Jerusalem, and the word of the Lord, that goes forth from Jerusalem, shall have a free course into the Gentile world. Thus the way of the Lord is prepared, for every mountain and hill shall be brought low, and plain and pleasant valleys shall come in the room of them, (Isa. 40:4). [4.] Those of the Jews that believe shall come in, and join themselves to the Gentiles, incorporate with them in the gospel-church: You shall flee to the valley of the mountains, that valley that is opened between the divided halves of the mount of Olives; they shall hasten into the church with the Gentiles, as formerly the Gentiles with them,

- His feet shall stand upon the Mount of Olives ”“ this was literally fulfilled when Jesus Himself stood upon the Mount of Olives during His lifetime?

What if in fact, it is speaking of the day when Christ returns and His feet shall stand in that Day upon the Mount of Olives?

- The splitting of the mountain was meant to show that the middle wall of partition between Jew and Gentile was split and done away with?

What if it was meant to prophesy of the time when the mount will actually be physically split at the return of Christ?

- The mountain being divided, half towards the north and the other half towards the south, there shall be a very great valley, that is, a broad way of communication opened between Jerusalem and the Gentile world, by which the Gentiles shall have free admission into the gospel-Jerusalem, and the word of the Lord, that goes forth from Jerusalem, shall have a free course into the Gentile world.

What if the valley being spoken of is just simply the literal valley that will lie between the two halves of the mountain now physically split?

14:10-11
10 All the land shall be turned into a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem. Jerusalem shall be raiised up and inhabited in her place from Benjamin's Gate to the place of the First Gate and the Corber Gate, and from the Tower of Hananel to the king's winepresses.

11 The people shall dwell in it; and no longer shall there be utter destruction, but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited.

Matthew Henry comments:

Some think this denotes particular favor to the people of the Jews, and points at their conversion and restoration in the latter days; but it is rather to be understood figuratively of the church, typified by Judah and Jerusalem, and it signifies the abundant graces with which the church shall be crowned, and the fruitfulness of its members, and the vast numbers of them. (1.) The church shall be like a fruitful country, abounding in all the rich products of the soil. The whole land of Judea, which is naturally uneven and hilly, shall be turned as a plain; it shall become a smooth level valley, from Geba, or Gibeah, its utmost border north, to Rimmon, which lay south of Jerusalem and was the utmost southern limit of Judea. The gospel of Christ, where it comes in its power, levels the ground; mountains and hills are brought low by it, that the Lord alone may be exalted. (2.) It shall be like a populous city. As the holy land shall be leveled, so the holy city shall be peopled, shall be rebuilt and replenished. Jerusalem shall be lifted up out of its low estate, shall be raised out of its ruins; when the land is turned as a plain, and not only the mount of Olives removed (v.  4), but other mountains too, then Jerusalem shall be lifted up, that is, shall appear the more conspicuous; she shall be inhabited in her place, even in Jerusalem, ch.  12:6 . The whole city shall be inhabited in the utmost extent of it, and no part of it left to lie waste. The utmost limits of it are here mentioned, between which there shall be no ground lost, but all built upon, from Benjamin’s-gate north-east to the corner-gate north-west, and from the tower of Hananeel in the south to the king’s wine-presses in the north; when the churches of Christ in all places are replenished with great numbers of holy, humble, serious Christians, and many such are daily added to it, then this promise is fulfilled. (3.) This country and this city shall both be safe, both the meat in the country and the mouths in the city: Those that dwell in it shall dwell securely, and there shall be none to make them afraid; there shall be no more of that utter destruction that has laid both town and country waste, no more anathema (as some read it), no more cutting off, no more curse, or separation from God to evil, no more such desolating judgments as you have been groaning under, but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited; there shall be no danger, nor any apprehension of it; neither shall its friends be fearful to disquiet themselves nor its enemies formidable to disquiet them. That promise of Christ explains this””that the gates of hell shall not prevail against the church; and so do the holy security and serenity of mind which believers enjoy in relying on the divine protection.

- Some think this denotes particular favor to the people of the Jews, and points at their conversion and restoration in the latter days; but it is rather to be understood figuratively of the gospel-church, typified by Judah and Jerusalem, and it signifies the abundant graces with which the church shall be crowned, and the fruitfulness of its members, and the vast numbers of them. The church shall be like a fruitful country, abounding in all the rich products of the soil.

Did Matthew Henry believe that the Jews would be converted and restored in the latter days?

What if, in keeping with the prophet Zechariah's original intent, the prophecy in these verses does indeed refer to a literal Judah and a literal Jerusalem? A last century Messianic Jew who was a Old Testament scholar asked, "If Judah and Jerusalem actually refer to the church in Old Testament prophecy, then what then does Israel refer to? If Israel refers to the church when mentioned in prophecy, then what does Judah refer to?"

Where does the allegorization end? Was Zechariah prophesying in purely allegorical terms of which the fulfillment would go so far so far as to change what is the common sense logical meaning of what he prophesied and that which he intended for his hearers to understand?

- Jerusalem shall be lifted up out of its low estate, shall be raised out of its ruins; when the land is turned as a plain, and not only the mount of Olives removed (v.4), but other mountains too, then Jerusalem shall be lifted up, that is, shall appear the more conspicuous; she shall be inhabited in her place, even in Jerusalem, (ch. 12:6). The whole city shall be inhabited in the utmost extent of it, and no part of it left to lie waste. The utmost limits of it are here mentioned, between which there shall be no ground lost, but all built upon, from Benjamin’s-gate north-east to the corner-gate north-west, and from the tower of Hananeel in the south to the king’s wine-presses in the north; when the churches of Christ in all places are replenished with great numbers of holy, humble, serious Christians, and many such are daily added to it, then this promise is fulfilled. (3.) This country and this city shall both be safe, both the meat in the country and the mouths in the city: Those that dwell in it shall dwell securely, and there shall be none to make them afraid; there shall be no more of that utter destruction that has laid both town and country waste, no more anathema (as some read it), no more cutting off, no more curse, or separation from God to evil, no more such desolating judgments as you have been groaning under, but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited; there shall be no danger, nor any apprehension of it; neither shall its friends be fearful to disquiet themselves nor its enemies formidable to disquiet them. That promise of Christ explains this””that the gates of hell shall not prevail against the church; and so do the holy security and serenity of mind which believers enjoy in relying on the divine protection.

What if Zechariah was in truth prophesying of Israel and Jerusalem in that day and not the church as we now know it?

TMK, do you really think Matthew Henry is explaining correctly the meaning of Zechariah 14?

There is a growing trend away from this type of allegorical hermeneutics, however well meaning it was meant but still followed which many see as non comprehensive and non consistent principles of prophetic interpretation.

Directed not at the good bro TMK directly, but more to the forum at large for a point of possible discussion.

"There are differences between literal and figurative approaches to Scripture and many times the allegorical method has been used to minimize the role played by the Jewish people in the plan of God."

"Typology and allegorical methods of interpretation are used today by a supersessionist approach to the Bible to reject the national and territorial promises of Israel and spiritualize them as being fulfilled in Jesus and the Church."

"Many scholars and theologians are saying there should be a more holistic reading of the Bible in which all of God's promises, including those that speak of the Jewish people and the Land of Israel, are truly fulfilled."

"Today, there is a general agreement among Evangelical theologians and biblical scholars that "spiritual interpretation" as traditionally practiced is not acceptable."

(By Dr. Craig A. Blaising - from "Hermeneutics, Theology, and Church History" - chapter on "Israel and Hermeneutics.")

The fact of the matter is that until Darby in the 19th century Zech 14 was not interpreted literally.

Of course this does not mean that Darby (and his dispensationalist progeny) are not right and every prior commentator was wrong.

But perhaps the more humble approach is to say "I’m not sure,” which is just what Luther said about this chapter.

…………… to reject the national and territorial promises of Israel and spiritualize them as being fulfilled in Jesus and the Church."

What do you say to these scripture:

1 Pet. 1:10-12 ”“
As to this salvation, the prophets who prophesied of the grace that would come to you made careful searches and inquiries, seeking to know what person or time the Spirit of Christ within them was indicating as He predicted the sufferings of Christ and the glories to follow. It was revealed to them that they were not serving themselves, but you, in these things which now have been announced to you through those who preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven-- things into which angels long to look.

Luke 24:44-47 ”“
Now He said to them, "These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things which are written about Me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled." Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures, and He said to them, "Thus it is written, that the Christ would suffer and rise again from the dead the third day, and that repentance for forgiveness of sins would be proclaimed in His name to all the nations, beginning from Jerusalem.

John 12:40-41 ”“
Therefore they could not believe, because Isaiah said again:
"He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts,
Lest they should see with their eyes,
Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn,
So that I should heal them.”
These things Isaiah said when he saw His glory and spoke of Him.

Acts 3:24 ””
Yes, and all the prophets, from Samuel and those who follow, as many as have spoken, have also foretold these days.

The Law was only a shadow of good things to come (Heb. 10:1).

Grace and TRUTH came through Jesus Christ (John 1:17)

The true Jew is the Jew in Christ (Rom. 2:28-29).

The true Israel is the Israel in Christ (Rom. 9:6-18, Gal. 3:29, 4:28).

The true Jerusalem is the New Jerusalem, the bride of Christ (Rev. 21:98-11).

The true temple is the church, the body of Christ (John 1:19-21, Eph. 1:22-23, 2:19-22).

The Old Covenant is obsolete (Heb. 8:13).

The New covenant is the glorious and eternal covenant in Jesus’ blood.

All who belong to Christ are Abraham’s descendants and heirs according to the promise (Gal. 3:29).

The country Abraham desired was a heavenly and not an earthly one.

Heb. 11:10,16 ”“
for he was looking for the city which has foundations, whose architect and builder is God……………But as it is, they desire a better country, that is, a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God; for He has prepared a city for them.

Also, consider:

Heb. 11:40 ”“
God having provided something better for us, that they should not be made perfect apart from us.

"Today, there is a general agreement among Evangelical theologians and biblical scholars that "spiritual interpretation" as traditionally practiced is not acceptable."

Do we stand on the Bible or on the general agreement among evangelical theologians and biblical scholars?

Do we stand on the wisdom of man or on CHRIST the power of God and the wisdom of God?

John 6:63 ”“
The words that I speak to you are SPIRIT, and they are life.

John 4:23-24 ”“
But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers. GOD IS SPIRIT, AND THOSE WHO WORSHIP HIM MUST WORSHIP IN SPIRIT AND TRUTH.

Romans 11:25-27

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

27 for this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

Jeremiah 30 Restoration of Israel and Judah

The word that came to Jeremiah from the Lord, saying, 2 "Thus speaks the Lord God of Israel, saying: ‘Write in a book for yourself all the words that I have spoken to you. 3 For behold, the days are coming,’ says the Lord, ‘that I will bring back from captivity My people Israel and Judah,’ says the Lord. ‘And I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it.’ ”

4 Now these are the words that the Lord spoke concerning Israel and Judah.

5 "For thus says the Lord:

‘We have heard a voice of trembling,
Of fear, and not of peace.
6 Ask now, and see,
Whether a man is ever in labor with child?
So why do I see every man with his hands on his loins
Like a woman in labor,
And all faces turned pale?
7 Alas! For that day is great,
So that none is like it;
And it is the time of Jacob’s trouble,
But he shall be saved out of it.

8 ‘For it shall come to pass in that day,’
Says the Lord of hosts,
‘That I will break his yoke from your neck,
And will burst your bonds;
Foreigners shall no more enslave them.
9 But they shall serve the Lord their God,
And David their king,
Whom I will raise up for them.

10 ‘Therefore do not fear, O My servant Jacob,’ says the Lord,
‘Nor be dismayed, O Israel;
For behold, I will save you from afar,
And your seed from the land of their captivity.
Jacob shall return, have rest and be quiet,
And no one shall make him afraid.
11 For I am with you,’ says the Lord, ‘to save you;
Though I make a full end of all nations where I have scattered you,
Yet I will not make a complete end of you.
But I will correct you in justice,
And will not let you go altogether unpunished.’

12 "For thus says the Lord:

‘Your affliction is incurable,
Your wound is severe.
13 There is no one to plead your cause,
That you may be bound up;
You have no healing medicines.
14 All your lovers have forgotten you;
They do not seek you;
For I have wounded you with the wound of an enemy,
With the chastisement of a cruel one,
For the multitude of your iniquities,
Because your sins have increased.
15 Why do you cry about your affliction?
Your sorrow is incurable.
Because of the multitude of your iniquities,
Because your sins have increased,
I have done these things to you.

16 ‘Therefore all those who devour you shall be devoured;
And all your adversaries, every one of them, shall go into captivity;
Those who plunder you shall become plunder,
And all who prey upon you I will make a prey.
17 For I will restore health to you
And heal you of your wounds,’ says the Lord,
‘Because they called you an outcast saying:
"This is Zion;
No one seeks her.” ’

18 "Thus says the Lord:

‘Behold, I will bring back the captivity of Jacob’s tents,
And have mercy on his dwelling places;
The city shall be built upon its own mound,
And the palace shall remain according to its own plan.
19 Then out of them shall proceed thanksgiving
And the voice of those who make merry;
I will multiply them, and they shall not diminish;
I will also glorify them, and they shall not be small.
20 Their children also shall be as before,
And their congregation shall be established before Me;
And I will punish all who oppress them.
21 Their nobles shall be from among them,
And their governor shall come from their midst;
Then I will cause him to draw near,
And he shall approach Me;
For who is this who pledged his heart to approach Me?’ says the Lord.
22 ‘You shall be My people,
And I will be your God.’ ”

23 Behold, the whirlwind of the Lord
Goes forth with fury,
A [e]continuing whirlwind;
It will fall violently on the head of the wicked.
24 The fierce anger of the Lord will not return until He has done it,
And until He has performed the intents of His heart.

In the latter days you will consider it.

Jeremiah 30

……… 3 For behold, the days are coming,’ says the Lord, ‘that I will bring back from captivity My people Israel and Judah,’ says the Lord. ‘And I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it……

The days that were coming were the days of the New Covenant ”“ Jer. 31:31-34, Heb. 8:7-13.

In the days of the New Covenant, "they would serve the Lord their God and David their king, whom I will raise up for them (Jer. 30:9).

Acts 2:38 ”“
"Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ.”

This happened in the 1st century AD.

The prophets prophesied of the sufferings of Christ and the GLORIES to follow (1 Pet. 1:10-12).

The land in the New Covenant is Christ.

Ezekiel 37:14 ”“
"I will put My Spirit within you and you will come to life, and I will place you on your own land. Then you will know that I, the LORD, have spoken and done it," declares the LORD.

The Lord Jesus said in John 14:20 ”“
"In that day you will know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you.”

"In that day” i.e. the day the Holy Spirit comes to indwell the believer.

"Christ in you, the hope of glory" -- Col. 1:27.

Romans 11:25-27

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

27 for this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

The hope and promise to Israel in Rom. 11 was not restoration of earthly territory but "life from the dead” (Rom. 11:15).

I will bring back the captives of My people Israel; they shall build the waste cities and inhabit them; they shall plant vineyards and drink wine from them; they shall also make gardens and eat fruit from them. I WILL PLANT THEM IN THEIR LAND, and no longer shall they be pulled up FROM THE LAND I HAVE GIVEN THEM, says the Lord your God. (Amos 9:14-15)

Then they shall DWELL IN THE LAND that I have given to Jacob My servant, where your fathers dwelt; and THEY SHALL DWELL THERE, they, their children, and their children's children, forever;.... (Ezekiel 37:25

In His days Judah will be saved, and Israel WILL DWELL SAFELY; (Jeremiah 23:6)

2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.

3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from JERUSALEM. (Isaiah 2:2-3)

After their spiritual restoration in Christ first.

Hi Todd. You said

"The fact of the matter is that until Darby in the 19th century Zech 14 was not interpreted literally."

John Gill (1697-1771) had this to say about Zechariah 14:
"For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle,.... Meaning not the Romans, in the time of Vespasian, for they were not all nations; nor did a part of the city only go into captivity then, but the whole; nor did any remain in it: it seems right to refer it to the gathering of the kings of the earth to the battle of the Lord God Almighty at Armageddon, Revelation 16:14."

Gill also says that *all* of Mt 24, including vs 29 and following pertain to the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD, so you will have to pick your poison.

I know. My point is Darby didn't invent the doctrine that Zechariah 14 and other passages like it pertain to the literal Second Coming of Christ out of whole cloth. As we can see from church history, sometimes biblical truths can be largely (but never completely) lost.

I just wanted to correct that particular misconception.

The prophecies in Zechariah concerning Christ are believed to have been literally fulfilled or will be in the future. Yet the prophecies regarding Christ returning to Israel, like He promised to do, and the restoration of Israel's place spiritually and physically are seen as allegories that don't really mean what the Holy Spirit through Zechariah meant them to say. It seems a inconsistent method of interpretation.