A longing for purity and for the presence of God

I think i battle with these things all the time

1 John 2:16
For everything in the world””the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life””comes not from the Father but from the world.

Matthew 5:8
Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God

I wish I could have a pure heart

Psalm 86:11
Teach me your way, Lord, that I may rely on your faithfulness; give me an undivided heart, that I may fear your name.

Exodus 33:15
Then Moses said to him, "If your Presence does not go with us, do not send us up from here.

I so long for the presence of God as it feels like a billion miles away

Psalm 51
New King James Version
A Prayer of Repentance
To the Chief Musician. A Psalm of David when Nathan the prophet went to him, after he had gone in to Bathsheba.

51 Have mercy upon me, O God,
According to Your lovingkindness;
According to the multitude of Your tender mercies,
Blot out my transgressions.
2
Wash me thoroughly from my iniquity,
And cleanse me from my sin.

3
For I acknowledge my transgressions,
And my sin is always before me.
4
Against You, You only, have I sinned,
And done this evil in Your sight””
That You may be found just [a]when You speak,
And blameless when You judge.

5
Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity,
And in sin my mother conceived me.
6
Behold, You desire truth in the inward parts,
And in the hidden part You will make me to know wisdom.

7
Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean;
Wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow.
8
Make me hear joy and gladness,
That the bones You have broken may rejoice.
9
Hide Your face from my sins,
And blot out all my iniquities

Create in me a clean heart, O God,
And renew a steadfast spirit within me.
11
Do not cast me away from Your presence,
And do not take Your Holy Spirit from me.

12
Restore to me the joy of Your salvation,
And uphold me by Your generous Spirit.
13
Then I will teach transgressors Your ways,
And sinners shall be converted to You.

14
Deliver me from the guilt of bloodshed, O God,
The God of my salvation,
And my tongue shall sing aloud of Your righteousness.
15
O Lord, open my lips,
And my mouth shall show forth Your praise.
16
For You do not desire sacrifice, or else I would give it;
You do not delight in burnt offering.
17
The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit,
A broken and a contrite heart””
These, O God, You will not despise.

18
Do good in Your good pleasure to Zion;
Build the walls of Jerusalem.
19
Then You shall be pleased with the sacrifices of righteousness,
With burnt offering and whole burnt offering;
Then they shall offer bulls on Your altar.

There are three different hebrew words used for iniquity or sin used in this passage

and when we sin like we all do we sin against god

I feel like I have sinned against god whenever we sin

I so want to have a pure heart, I wish that like a computer that god can service me

Hello Dom

It is wonderful that you are hungering and thirsting for righteousness. God wants a pure heart for you as much as you want it. I encourage you to read the testimonies of those of the Great Awakenings in America.

What is the usual teaching is, that you 'make the way straight for the Lord' by writing down your sins and putting right the ones you can - like restoring things stolen in the past.

I found Oswald Chambers very helpful, and The Normal Christian Life by Nee and can give you some links.

The pure heart was considered by the early church as the psychological healing we all need on our way to full union with Christ and the peace and joy that brings. Praying for you brother.

Dom I don't know if you have come across this web site:

https://enterhisrest.net/index.htm

It has a lot of testimonies therein. I knew brother Tom Plumb for a few years before he went to be with the Lord and we discussed our disagreements about Keswick theology so I don't go along with everything he taught, but his teaching was certainly on the pathway to holiness therefore valuable, the history of the Holiness Movement very much so.

"What is the usual teaching is, that you 'make the way straight for the Lord' by writing down your sins and putting right the ones you can - like restoring things stolen in the past."

Brother it must start here, then admit any sins as the Holy Spirit pushes you to anyone you have sinned against period! At this point you know you need to apologize and come clean. One of the many things having the Holy Spirit living within us is He reveals things we need to correct, for peace to come sometimes we have to be honest with others. Listen to the Holy Spirit brother, it is better to obey God, submit, and let what may come, then to grieve the Holy Spirit of God. Better all to look down on us then to be at odds with God dear brother. He above all else matters.

Can you, dear brother, tell if you 'have received the Holy Spirit' since you believed? I ask because this requires a different approach if not.

brendaM

https://enterhisrest.net/index.htm

I know the guy who has taken over that website since Tom Plumb has passed away. I was attending online Holiness meetings with Him. Frank Warner, George Delo and Warren Larkin all attend these online meetings.

Don't know if you any of these guys.

DeltaDom Quote: I wish I could have a pure heart.

If you look at the scripture blessed are the pure in heart.

It also means being of a single mind.

Which ties in with the verse you mention

Psalm 86:11
Teach me your way, Lord, that I may rely on your faithfulness; give me an undivided heart, that I may fear your name.

The heart is the mind, will and emotions.

It's a worth while study..

Colin, I contacted George Delo, whose email address was on Tom's site, after I heard of Tom's death, when I could not get the link to work. George told me the circumstances surrounding his death that I was very sorry to hear as I was very concerned that Tom had started taking some medication which was very much contraindicated while there is a diet that would have been effective and safe to slowly detox.

I had been in contact with Tom for theological discussion and health issues, for a number of years, after hearing on Enter His Rest, that he, like myself was badly poisoned with mercury and looking for answers in natural medicine. His was not due to medications like mine, but from clumsy amalgam removal.

George put me in touch with Frank and I later met Warren at the online meetings and wanted to have contact with Warren because he said a few things that made me think he was in agreement with me, as opposed to the others and I still have not been able to make that contact.

I don't know whether you know or not, but the others all subscribe to Keswick theology whereby I differ. This theology was a later development to the traditional holiness one which has its roots in the early church fathers.

As the online meeting is for teaching, I foresaw that they would not offer me a place to with join that, but only for correcting me. I am not saying they are way out or anything, just that theirs is not the full teaching and misleads from that found in the ECF's which goes further than Keswick.

Hi - I think I remember you, your microphone wasn't to good, dark shoulder length hair, with glasses?

What is ECF'S?

Eastern Church Fathers? I also see you mention George Fox was you are Friend at some point.

Yes that's right!

Early church fathers. The early early ones definitely pre Nicene ones up to 3rd century. They soon had errors internally.

I came across the early Quaker writings at the same time as I was reading holiness writings from the great revivals and found Fox to be very enlightened taught directly from God, but soon the Quakers went south after he died. Quaker Barclays' Apology available online is a good read. It took me out of Protestantism way before Orthodoxy confirmed their writings on holiness and the pure heart.

And that is the issue I would say. Any good movement is never immune to going south. So we are ever forced to glen with caution here and caution there. And never to throw out a movement in a maner that would seem like a baby and the bathing water. Great revivals seem to end in sadness.

That's because they do not have a firm foundation that they are fleeting. There should be no such thing as a revival - we should all be revived all of the time.

I have mentioned one issue - the refusal to accept the authority of the church at the beginning on the Filioque - yes it makes a big difference to ones theology - and allow heresy in. The whole of the west has fallen step by step and just look at how western civilization has fallen - all due to the church failing repeatedly to keep to that which was once delivered to the saints.

Sister I agree with you. We at best are suppose to be revived at all times. But it sadly seems like we cannot pay the price required to sustain the fire. So we eventually fall back to lukewarm and coldness. And then have to start over to get back to the fire (revival). Or do you know of a place where this is the case (fire always) - yes I am ashamed to ask this? You mentioned that the Orthodox eventually drifted off too. It just seems evident that whenever the Church is on fire, the devil pull up his socks too!

The teaching that leads to constant revival aka entire sanctification or Thesosis continued till quite recent times (1990) in Orthodoxy but the opposing side gained more power over that time after being found even in the NT amongst those that opposed Paul. It has been wiped out in the rest of the church apart from a few pockets but is seeing a comeback.

They did not have revivals in the early church - they stayed revived or they never were.

I still do not believe that there was an age where error (the devil) was not threatening. Paul essentially said to the Galatians: "Who has bewitched you?" Having began in the fire (Spirit) now you are drifting away to coldness?

You did not read my post properly and I have no time to keep saying the same things to you as before.

I have already noted twice (on another thread) that it is possible to get wrong. Unless if you believe I am for the enemy I would expect you kindly point out where I am having you repeat your self like one whose time is not their own but the Lord's. You mentioned there were no revivals or they were never revived. Paul also said to a group that my rebuking you has led to repeatence. Shall we not call that revival? The Church of Laodicean was found lukewarm by Christ. Did they not need a revival. Really sorry if I am just missing your points.

I said 'the opposing side gained more power over that time after being found even in the NT amongst those that opposed Paul.'

Many in the early years were in error not surprisingly. Paul and the other Apostles had to labour with them to show them the truth as teachers of holiness. When there were more teachers, the church could grow with revived peoples which were called saints and had halos round their heads in early art.

Writing is a bit sparse during this change-over period.

Ok I see what I had missed. But take the church of Laodicean and duplicate its state a few times and lets see if we will not be having dryness that looks like our modern day? Notice Christ did not blame the Appostles for not ensuring the Church of Laodicea is sound but blamed the Church itself. Several (Laodicean churches) in our modern day needs a revival to get rid of their lukewarm and return to fire.

P.S: I say duplicate becuase Christedom has grown eversince them. So we wont have one church of Laodicean but a number of them. But the same way Laodicean grew cold can account for the many cold today. And revival is needed.

But they need a revival based on a firm foundation that will withstand the storms that follow. If they believe that we can only keep our 'old man' under control and not eradicated, then he will slip back so very easily.

This is what Keswick does, it promises much but delivers little because man does not like to accept that he should be without sin or out of the blessing. His sin nature wants a bit of 'elbow room'.

Kervin I suggest you get onto Enter His Rest:

https://enterhisrest.net/index.htm

and study the subject with its wealth of holiness writings to get a basis in it instead of asking me to hold your hand to understand higher teachings. Especially testimonies.

I will gladly answer questions from people who have done their own homework.