The Truth About Katrina?

I am not saying I agree or disagree with this, but thought it was interesting; especially considering that this week in New Orleans, they were supposed to hold what is called "Decadence Day" for the gay community. Any thoughts?-------------------From 'Olive Tree Ministries':What you won't hear anywhere is that this week New Orleans was to observe "Southern Decadence Day" with 100,000 homosexuals gathering there to commit unspeakable acts in public. Previous events were photographed and sent to the mayor and police officials but they did not care. They had their own lust: The $100,000,000 the event brings in. Gambling casinos took a hit on the coast as this is where the eye of the storm hit. And as America forced Israelis out of parts of their land, hurricaneKatrina was building in the Atlantic. A Fox reporter said, "It must be an emotional experience (for Americans) to walk away from their homes and not ever live in them again." Same with those forced out in Israel. Israeli homes are being demolished as Gulf Coast homes are demolished. This was America's greatest "evacuation." Now we have "refugees". Israelis were evacuated and many are refugees living in tents andrefugee centers, thanks to America. The Israeli uprooting will affect their entire economy in that some of their finest produce which was exported is now left behind. America's economy could face a steep recession as oil processingrefineries were damaged. Plan to see price increases within days. Will this bring our economy down? Major industries will be affected from food delivery, jet fuel, travel, insurance, and so much more with the "ripple effect" of skyrocketing gas prices. -------------------------------------(3) "We REAP What we SOW"-by Amy Methvin. I am going out on a limb with what I am about to say. It may strike a nerve, and I am sorry if that does happen. But in these days people must hear the TRUTH, even if it is uncomfortable. I knew, as this country has pushed the "roadmap to peace" in Israel that for our country there would be dire consequences. And as I watched the people of Gaza Strip driven from their homes, I knew in my spirit there would be very swift (within a few weeks atbest) consequences for our country. In case you don't know, the USA is the driving force behind these agreements. I just wasn't prepared for the obvious parallel in reaping what we sowed. It was just a couple of weeks ago, that we watched the people of Gaza driven, weeping, from their homes. They were forced to leave their homes on and near the sea, as their government then came in and bulldozed those homes. Where are these people now? They are in government shelters and government housing. They are basically homeless. Now look at our situation. Our neighbors on and near the sea have been driven from their homes and their homes have been destroyed. They, too, are weeping and homeless, dependent on the government. One can scoff and say that this is just coincidence, but there are no coincidences in the Lord. The Bible says that we reap what we sow, and that those who bless Israel will be blessed, and those who curse Israel will be cursed. I have been told by several people that government officials (even up to the VERY top) have been warned of the consequences of forcing Israel to give up land. And I believe that would be like the Lord to warn first. However, our government did not heed the warning, but pressed on with what seemed right in their own eyes. I hope this will give us all better understanding of the verses in Proverbs 3:5-6 "Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and do not lean on your own understanding, in all your ways acknowledge Him and He will make your paths straight." If you need Scripture for a confirmation of "recompense" for removing Israel from its territory, see Joel 3.Even in the midst of this destruction here in our country and for those in Israel, God is at work. He CAUSES all things to work together for good for those who are called according to His purposes. Many will call upon His Name during these days and be saved. So pray that people will open their eyes and call upon Him. I certainly don't pretend to know all the ways of the Lord, but this seemed pretty easy to discern. In these days let us all seek the Lord while He can still be found. My love to you all. ~Amy Methvin.---------------------------

krispy, i'd start praying for your state

And as America forced Israelis out of parts of their land, hurricane Katrina was building in the Atlantic. A Fox reporter said, "It must be an emotional experience (for Americans) to walk away from their homes and not ever live in them again." Same with those forced out in Israel. Israeli homes are being demolished as Gulf Coast homes are demolished. I don't want to jump to conclusions. Am I missing something here?As regards making a firm link between the city's sin and its present suffering, I would be cautious. “There were present at that season some who told Him about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices. And Jesus answered and said to them, “Do you suppose that these Galileans were worse sinners than all other Galileans, because they suffered such things? I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish. Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them, do you think that they were worse sinners than all other men who dwelt in Jerusalem? I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.”” (Luke 13:1-5, NKJV)If you ask Christ 'is there an immediate cause and effect relationship between 'sin' and 'suffering'? his answer, twice over, is "I tell you, no."

Hi Ron,you bring up a good point! I used to be very quick to judge : disaster=judgement. again, many people equate sickness and judgment as well. And i know now from personal experience with my own health problems, etc.. that it was not judgement- but I do look at it as a refinement of sorts. I see the Lord using my 'afflictions' as a means to draw me closer to Him and refine me. To learn to seek comfort in the only "Comforter"- to learn to rely on Him alone.Are we to say that those who suffer from illnesses also are being judged by God? Or those who go through terrible tragedies? No. We know that is not true. Yes, there are consequences for all actions, for all sin. I really don't know the answer to all of this. What I do believe is, we say that God controls the waves of the sea and the wind, etc- so we know that He is in control. He has allowed this to happen for whatever reason. I hope that just as I learned to draw closer to Him and rely on Him as my Comfortor, as I have let my afflictions mold me and refine me- that these many people suffering from the hurricane may find the same Comfortor, that they may let these hard times bring them to the Lord and refine them :)I am still getting rid of alot of old mindsets and I pray that I would think like Christ in all situations. Hopefully I am getting there day by day :-) In Him, Chanin

We cannot deny that divine judgment is a Biblical message. However, trying to figure out the root cause of this “act of God” gets very sticky. I heard that someone blamed the US gov’t for not signing the Kyoto agreement. Many Christians attribute it to the gays and casinos. Some relate it to the Gaza withdrawal. But what about the most obvious cause? If global warming produces more severe hurricanes, and if global warming is the result of gas emissions, etc, then, who is really to blame? Is it not the lifestyle of the West in general – largely America. (can’t exclude Canada who feasts off the wealth too)Let me tell you a story: In 1980 my husband and I returned home after a three-year term as overseas missionaries. For three years we had lived among simple people with a simple living standard. After our return I was in shock over the level of prosperity. When I went into a church, I could hardly worship because of my shock over the luxury - such things as the lovely carpet, the chandeliers, and many other symbols of western wealth. I was in shock because no one there seemed to be embarrassed or apologetic by their wealth. After a few years I got used to it and it felt normal. (Familiarity does that to you.)The last commandment, “Do not covet” is repeated many times in the NT. We are commanded not love the world, or the things in the world. We are supposed to be strangers and aliens in this world. Yet we have not been following this. We have lived too much like the others in our culture!! We have thus contributed to the global warming through our consumerism, and thus to the disasters. The Bible has much to say about the distribution of wealth. Apparently 4% of the world population is American, and they hold 25% of the world’s wealth. Doesn’t something seem wrong here? Scripture says: Judgment begins in the house of God. So, I urge my fellow believers to look at our own “stuff”, and repent, and live the lifestyle that Jesus called us to. How can we expect the world to be any better than us. It’s time to be shaken out of our comfortable feelings and be filled with shock and grief over our decadence.

I know in Americian history the government used to call an solemn assembly when large disasters hit America to seek the face of God.During 9-11 I was on a business trip in Las Vegas. We as Christians may question whats going on, but I never seen the likes of people dropping their madness. Even the casinos were invoking God on their megatrons. The whole place emptied out as if God had showed up. On the way home I drove 1500 miles nearly. Secular stations dropped their usual format and played songs like Amazing Grace. For a hot second the nation seemed to "come to herself"- but as soon as she found relief... I think of a Wilkerson message, "The Towers Have Fallen and We Missed the Message." Very sobering what he said in that sermon. It was almost prophetic.

Honestly, since our big fires here in California a couple years ago, I've started considering natural disasters as God's judgment. I heard on the news about the casinos getting damaged by the hurricane Katrina, and I thought the same thing. We know it's not Mother Nature, and as far as I know, God still holds the heavens and all in it together. Our country sure does deserve judgment.At the same time, saying that hurricane Katrina was a result of God's judgment wouldn't be something you'd say to someone who is suffering over there. God's judgment comes after His longsuffering love, and then afterwards, He continues to pour out His love to the broken and humble.

KrispyKrittr wrote:Interesting to think about... since the Cherokee reservation here in Western North Carolina opened up casinos, we have had a number of natural disasters. The worst was when we were hit with 2 back to back hurricanes... and we are in the mountains... we NEVER get hurricanes. They usually die out before they get this far inland.The NC state government just voted in the lottery this morning... think I'll go hide under my bed now!KrispySo would it be fair to say since Texas does not allow gambling is why the hurricane took a right turn towards sin city?

As an unbeliever, over thirty years ago, I walked the French Quarter of New Orleans. Even as an unsaved person I recognized that something was very wrong. It seemed if there was a God he would destroy the whole city. Off one of the streets of Bourbon Street I looked up at the night sky and said, "God if you are really up there let me know. Within a year I was born again.It was only the mercy of God that kept me from experiencing God's wrath as an unbeliever and is only the mercy of God that has kept New Orleans from experiencing worse that what is going on there right now. It seems to me that all of the US is going to see much worse if there isn't revival soon. This country is a sin polluted land with innocent blood on its hands. Jonathan Edwards spoke of a sinner walking on a floor of rotten wood over the fire of hell. It seems that the US has been on that wood for quite awhile.Just because there are Christians in the US doesn't mean the US won't see the judgement of God. Jeremiah was in Jerusalem when it fell. The rain falls on the just and the unjust. God will be with the believer through the worst but that doesn't mean we won't go through the worst.In Christ,GaryE

Interesting Scripture:Luk 21:25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;

Where is gambling specifically forbidden in the Bible? Seems like having a casino is judgment enough for a city allowing a casino. Is the gay pride parade any worse than the debauchery that happens day in and day out in the french quarter? Seems like a general gathering place for those who have hardened their hearts toward God. Doesn't it seem ironic that they would choose a location below sea level next to the sea to engage in things that would seem to so easily call forth for judgment? It's like running through a storm carrying an metal pole and cursing God. If you get hit by lightning, was it God's judgment or just natural consequence? Will man caused 'global warming' be the excuse given when the earth groans in labor, thus allowing a generation no reason to think it's spiritual in nature? I think I should repent, lest I likewise perish.

markm wrote:Where is gambling specifically forbidden in the Bible? There are not many specific references to gambling in the Bible. The major one is when some soldiers at the foot of the cross gambled to see who would win Jesus' garments. Some gamblers justify their gambling by sighting the fact of the lack of biblical references on gambling. They assume that since gambling is not specifically forbidden, it must be okay. If we took this logic, then we could argue that taking drugs is okay too, since the Bible does not specifically forbid it.Let me share five basic reasons why I believe gambling is wrong:1. It's against the golden rule. Jesus teaches us to "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." Gambling perverts this law by wording the golden rule this way: "Do unto others before they do it unto you." No gambler desires the best for his fellow man. Instead, he wants his fellow gamblers to lose so that he could win. This is selfishness.A man asked the Lord if gambling was right or wrong. The Lord answered him, "Son, I want everyone to win, and in gambling some have to lose so others can win." We are to pray for others, not prey on them.2. It's against the work ethic.Ephesians 4:28 says: He...must work, doing something useful with his own hands, that he may have something to share with those in need.Gambling does not produce anything useful or profitable. Gambling does not increase our gross national product; it only causes money to change hands.3. It's against godly prosperity.Proverbs 13:11 says: Dishonest money dwindles away, but he who gathers money little by little makes it grow.God's plan for prosperity is simple: Make all you can, save all you can, and give all you can. Notice that this scripture proves that prosperity comes when you allow it to gradually grow. In gambling, people are looking for the big-pie-in-the-sky. They want to hit it big RIGHT AWAY.The only ones making money in gambling are the casinos and bookies. And how do they get rich? Little by little. Bookies are satisfied with simply a small percentage of everyone's bets. In time they become rich.4. It's against the command not to covet.The tenth commandment says, "You shall not covet...You shall not set your desire on your neighbor's house or land...or anything that belongs to your neighbor." Gambling is based totally on coveting what belongs to others.5. It's against wisdom.And finally, it's plain stupid to gamble. The odds are always against you when betting against organized gambling—casinos, race tracks, bookies, lotteries, bingo halls, etc. Organized gambling will prance the few gamblers who got lucky in order to entice others into stupidity. Don't be fooled into thinking that you're going to get rich by gambling. You won't.6. It's addictive.There are some addictions that are quite harmless, such as coffee. However, gambling is not one them. It is very addictive and this addiction will ruin families and wreck people's financial security. Peter said, "For a man is a slave to whatever has mastered him" (2 Peter 2:19).I have seen good people turn into thieves all because of the uncontrollable urge to gamble. A lady in my church told me how faithful she once served the Lord until she became addicted to this vice. One day in a casino she lost everything, and while she thought no one was looking, she stole a bucket of coins and ran off. She got caught and learned the high price of low living. It can happen to anyone.These are some of the reasons why I feel that gambling is wrong.

We cannot deny that divine judgment is a Biblical message. However, trying to figure out the root cause of this “act of God” gets very sticky. I heard that someone blamed the US gov’t for not signing the Kyoto agreement. Many Christians attribute it to the gays and casinos. Some relate it to the Gaza withdrawal. It is certainly an Old Testament biblical message. What does the New Testament have to say about these things? (genuine question)

Philologos,you wrote: If you ask Christ 'is there an immediate cause and effect relationship between 'sin' and 'suffering'? his answer, twice over, is "I tell you, no."It is true there may be no immediate repercussions for sins commited, but judgment is coming. Romans 2:2 tells us 'We know that the judgment of God rightly falls upon those who practice such things." (NASB) These are the sins mentioned in chapter 1: sexul perversion, unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, malice, full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, gossips, slanders, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving,unmerciful...that those who practice such things are worthy of death...they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them. (Romans 1:) The south is known as the Bible belt, meaning there are a lot of people here who go to church regularly and call themselves Christians. Many are heavily influenced by radical Calvinism. This means they think that once they are 'saved' lifestyle will not matter because they are saved and going to heaven. Hence, you will find all kinds of unrepentent sins among these people. People will not make a call on questionable behaviour because we are not to judge. (They do not read the rest of Romans 2, apparently). Twenty years ago, more or less, a vote came up in this state on whether to allow for the sale of alcoholic beverages. If all of the professing Christians had voted 'no' it would to this day be a dry state. Having worked at a CPC so many years it is shocking what goes behind the scenes. 'Popular Christianity' in the south is rotten to the core. Fortunately, not all Christians in the south are apostate. My point? Many people in the south call themselves christians but live ungodly lives. The Bible tells us judgment must begin at the house of God. This calamity, IMHO, is wake-up call to the people - and not just them but for every thinking person. Are we ready to die? Some of the ones that died may have been godly. Either way, I doubt any who died were expecting life to end so soon for them. The purpose of judgment is to wake people up to the realities of God's holiness and his will that all men repent. (God takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked).With the severe devastation in MS and LA there will be lots of opportunities for people to demonstrate the love of Jesus. Might also be a good opportunity for Jesse Morrell to preach...he might not get thrown in jail...ginnyrose

"The Towers Have Fallen and We Missed the Message." Does SI have this sermon somewhere to listen to?In Christ,Doug