sermonindex
Dec 21, 2005
You can find the article here. Bubhttp://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4545822.stm
You can find the article here. Bubhttp://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4545822.stm
He (the judge)accused them (The ID supporters) of "breathtaking inanity", of lying under oath and of trying to introduce religion into schools through the back door. ID can't be science, because science can't mention God...what a tautological hoodwink. It's mountebanks like this fellow, who are so committed to keeping children away from "religion" that he's actually dumbing down our socialized school systems. They don't want children thinking critically about evolution...they simply want them to believe in it.Well, he's wrong...this isn’t a back door for religion...the real back door is private school vouchers and tax funded home school programs where parents can exercise more influence over their children...while draining public funds away from public classrooms. :smart: MC
Our Christ said That the world would not recieve him and would hate him. a good case has facts were is evil-utions facts. you can't imagine facts and the more you have to believe the more of a religion it becomes.as for church and state. Why is the state in the church if there is a dividing line that can't be crossed IRS 401 C 3. why is it the IRS can tell a church what to talk about.state gives them lic. for marrying people. it don't sound like there is a dividing line with all the strings the goverment has on the church. It was ment to be state out of the church not church out of the goverment. we are a christain nation trying to get God out of our lives. no wonder other nations don't know who we are we don't know ourselves.
A large problem with intelligent design is that it assumes that God didn't get it right in the first place and has to intervene in order for life forms to progress and "evolve." If you believe in both evolution and God, as I do, God does not need to intervene, as the creation was geared to produce life. Bub
what do you mean you believe in both evolution and God ? If you believe in evolution then you dont believe in the bible . The bible says the world was made in 6 days not billions of years! AARON
ID can't be science, because science can't mention God...Bro, Isn't that a bit old-fashioned now?What I wanted to put in this melting pot is a tiny bit of historical information.Isaac Newton was the first person to think up 'ID' and it was because he wanted - with many other founder members of the Royal Society (set up by Charles II of England as soon as he became king - 1660) - to use mathematical proofs that there was order in the universe to PROVE that an intelligent being - GOD - had made it (the universe). This was to counter the growing numbers of intellectuals who were turning away from God. Now, before you jump to conclusions about a growing lack of enthusiasm for 'church' and church-related things, you have to look a the history thoroughly. People were still being put to death for certain strands of CHRISTIAN religious beliefs, too.Incidentally, George Herbert's oldest brother was the first person to define what we now know as Deism. There were also, for the first time, people coming out of the woodwork disputing the Bible, others disputing the existence of God for all the usual reasons, and still others hoping that science would prove He does not exist - rather than the other way round.Just for good measure, Newton himself attended the Anglican church publicly, because everyone was expected to attend the church of the king, or, some other approved type of Christian gathering, but 'privately' he was not an Anglican by persuasion, and even more privately, he disputed the deity of Christ, having been influenced by the resurgence of Arianism in Europe.
Dorcas,Apparently Judge John Jones is smarter then Isaac Newton. The English mathematical genius who invented calculus would be banned from teaching in the world-class Dover school system. This is how advanced our educational system has become. Someone needs to drop an apple on Jone's head.:-) MC
English mathematical genius who invented calculus would be banned from teaching in the world-class Dover school system. Help, bro! What does this mean? (Sorry to be a bit slow....... Dover?) (I know what calculus is.)
Dover is the name of the town where the monkey trial referenced in Bubbaguy's post took place.
But Judge Jones said he had determined that ID was not science and "cannot uncouple itself from its creationist, and thus religious, antecedents". Ah! Now, I'm not sure who looks more foolish, me or him. Thanks for putting me right, MC. I should have read the article, shouldn't I? the real back door is private school vouchers and tax funded home school programs where parents can exercise more influence over their childrenDoesn't this cut both ways? Or is that what you meant?
Doesn't this cut both ways? Or is that what you meant?It does...I was stating it as a consequence, trying to avoid cheering or booing. My children attend public schools, but I realize they can because we live in a one stoplight town far from the political battles of the city schools. I believe public schools in small towns can provide excellent education. Yet my wife and I are a weekly presence in the halls of every building our children have to walk in. We let the teachers and principles know we care. We have a connection to the quality people working in our schools...but perhaps if we were in a larger system our involvement would be of little value.What irritates me is when politicians and left wingers invoke "separation of church and state" regarding public community schools. Since when were my children considered part of the state? :-? As we say in America..."Them fightin' words!"MC
Another tidbit of historical information. ID has its basis in the Design Argument, one of the five classical proofs of God's existence. So its history goes all the way back to Thomas Aquinas (13th century), whose work is based on Aristotle.However, research on ID is still at a very early stage. As William Dembski (mathematician and ID proponent) had noted, for ID to gain academic respectability, a lot more work has to be done - we need more top-notch scientists who are Christians to contribute academically.(We have made quite a lot of progress over the decades. For instance, Antony Flew, a key atheist and philosopher for fifty years, have turned to deism, acknowledging the case for the existence of God is much stronger than he thought many years ago. He attributed his change of mind to the efforts of Christian philosophers such as Richard Swinburne, Alvin Platinga, William Lane Craig, JP Moreland, Gabermas, etc., who have established themselves as extremely and professing Christians in the field of philosophy. We need similar advances in science!)I am also concerned about how the ID agenda is being pushed at school boards. If we play along with the power game, vying for political power, we might lost sight of the real goal of ID -- a love for the truth and the belief that if atheistic presuppositions are removed, it is possible to make a strong case for a supreme intelligent being. Our ultimate goal is the truth, not to win a political battle.Publicity is not always good, as media often manage to twist the efforts of Christians (and those of other faiths!).
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